Jadeite

I've had the JVR Vac100 for a couple of years now and love it. I even upgraded mine with a new circuit board when they added new features (specifically stopping/sealing in the middle of a cycle and a pre-set clean pump cycle) and it was super easy both dealing with the company and doing the switch. The fact you can literally replace every part on it is a huge bonus. 

Also (because I am such a huge fan of them) the link that @tekobo provided above has a GREAT write-up on my favourite line of canning jars: Weck. They are great for water bath AND pressure canning and I have WAY WAY too many of them. Here is the link: https://www.healthycanning.com/weck-jars/

13 hours ago, tekobo said:

Thanks @Jadeite, @jeffshoaf.  I did some research myself and found this article which helped me remember where I got the method from: https://www.healthycanning.com/why-old-british-method-of-bottling-is-unsafe#The_kicker_doing_your_home_canning_safely_is_actually_less_work  

They recommend the American "canning" method too.  I will try that.  That said, it is all about risk and I suspect the % risk increase between the two methods is not that great if you are careful with either method.  You can just be sure you have the 100%(?) safe stamp from the USDA if you go their route.  

So thank you for that insight.  

 

Thanks for linking the article. I know I've read the "You don't have to sterilize as a separate step anymore" a number of times but it is good to have a source readily available.

4 hours ago, jeffshoaf said:

I've found a bag that's been reported as being reliably sealed by my model chamber vac but it's currently out of stock except in the 100 count pack so I'm not jumping on it yet.

I'm having a difficult time finding a pressure canner; since a loaded canner is pretty heavy, most are made of aluminum and won't work with my stovetop or hot plate since those are both induction units. Presto does make a canner with a clad bottom that works with induction but it's bigger than I was hoping for. It looks like Fagor made a few small induction canners but Fagor didn't survive the Spanish financial crisis of a few years ago.

I do have a side burner on my natural gas grill that I could use with an aluminum canner but it's very aggravating to deal with - it doesn't adjust smoothly and it's prone to go out unless it's running wide open. My brother has several propane burners so I could borrow one of those to play with if I can borrow a canner from someone. While I do have several natural gas outlets outside that I could use with a natural gas burner for canning, I don't currently really have any other use for a gas burner - my brother generally does any frying for cookouts.

Presto does make an electric canner (kinda like an Instant Pot, but made specifically for canning) that looks interesting but it's a bit pricey ($350 US) - I'd spend that if I knew I'd get a lot of have out of it but I don't know that... It's also large for its capacity so presents a little storage concern. 

I also have induction and what I am most likely going to do (when I get around to wanting to pressure can) is I will be buying an outdoor Campchef propane stove (probably the single burner model) and using that until we eventually remodel our kitchen. At that point my grand plan is to have our induction top but install a single gas burner just for canning/non-induction cookware.

The outdoor campchef option apparently has its pitfalls too depending on who you ask. The Presto Pressure canners do not recommend ANY outdoor burner solution as the BTUs are far too high according to the company. I've read numerous people online have used them but it seems to be a 'the risk is on you' situation. The All-Americans aren't quite as specific in their warnings and from what I've read if you stick to an outdoor burner between 15,000-30,000 BTU you should be fine. As you also said there is a Presto Induction Capable Pressure canner (which I also have owned) but it only comes in the 23qt size.

I personally own two All-American Pressure Canners but A: They are MUCH more expensive than Presto and B: They are SEVERELY backordered right now from the manufacturer (6-9 months+ depending on model) but they are to my understanding the Rolls-Royce of pressure canners. I luckily got mine earlier this year before they ran out for the year AND before the price went up. 

Until I can figure out if I want to do the Campchef route, I will be sticking to water bath canning.

On 8/4/2022 at 9:04 PM, jeffshoaf said:

I'm confused by thIs statement - why would they not work for water processing? I've found several references that indicate they're fine for water bath processing. The only concern I've seen is that you shouldn't placed the bags directly on the bottom of the pot for water bath or pressure canning (be sure to use a rack).

Perhaps it would be better to say I do not see the point of using retort bags for high acid/jellies/jams. I suppose space savings would be the only pro vs jars but given that retort bags are one time use and generally more expensive per bag vs jars I am not sure if I would consider the space savings enough of a reason.

18 hours ago, tekobo said:

This is a helpful thread.  It would be good to know if anyone thinks there is danger in the way that I currently bottle (or can) jars.  It is a method I read up ages ago and I use it all the time with no issues so far.

Once my jars have been washed in the dishwasher I store them with their lids on.  When time comes to fill with hot produce I put the jars in the oven for about 20 minutes at about 120C.  I also put the rubber rings or lids in a bowl of hot water.  To avoid cracking the bottles when I pour in hot chutneys or pickling liquid, I put a spoon into the jar touching the bottom of the jar.  I fill up, leaving a small air gap, take the spoon out and put the lid on.  I sometimes also turn the filled and sealed jars upside down while still hot and that seems to help the seal.  I don't use a water bath or any other method.   When the jars are cool I check to see if the lids are able to be tightened further and I also tug at the seals on kilner jars to make sure that they are solidly held in place.  This works for me and I have never had any spoilage.   

Any flaws or unnecessary steps that you can see?

P.S.  I don't know that I would go for retort bags.  We have stand up vacuum pouches for sauces and liquids which store very compactly in the freezer for the type of thing I think you are talking about @jeffshoaf. 

This is a complicated question because depending on where (and when) you grew up the answer is very different. According to the USDA (and Canadian equivalent) what you are doing is NOT safe. Jars must be water bath canned or pressure canned (based on the recipe) and no other method is considered safe. The jars may seal with your method but they are not considered processed/preserved by modern North American standards. I had a friend YEARS ago that also did a variation of your method (he did full on Oven canning which is once again not USDA recommended) and we agreed to disagree and not talk about it as it was always a very strong point of contention between us. Personally I would never do anything but full water bath canning or pressure canning. I would never do Oven canning or hot pack/turn over sealing like you do.

Now having said this I don't always follow USDA guidelines. For instance I prefer WECK jars from Germany vs Mason jars but they are not USDA certified. I know using Water Bath/Pressuring canning though they'd be 100% safe if processed correctly. 

2 hours ago, jeffshoaf said:

Hmmm... I was researching canning a while back and everything I looked at still had the whole jar sanitizing thing as part of the process. It would be difficult for me to find the space to do the sanitizing and keep the jars isolated between sanitizing and filling. Without that requirement, I'd be able to do the actual pressurizing out on the screened-in deck and not heat up the kitchen. My folks always had a huge garden when I was growing up and my mother did a lot of canning in the kitchen of our non- air conditioned house and it was pretty swampy in the whole house during that process!

I think the canned bags would be more convenient to store than jars as well. I tend to keep my freezers full of meat so I'm looking at alternatives to freezing for fruit and soups/sauces.

Yes, I'm aware of the pressure requirement; pretty much every source I've referenced has even recommended using the jar canning pressures and times, but stress the need to add additional time (30% more time). I think you got it backwards tho (typo?) - jams/jellies/high acid foods can be water-bath canned since the acid helps kill the bad stuff that the higher temps take care of during pressure canning.

Yeah I think you can pretty much safely skip the sanitizing part. A good hot soapy wash and just keep them covered with a tea towel and ready to fill. Most of the time now I use my dishwasher to wash them (with or without the sanitize cycle) and just leave the door closed until I am ready for them. In a pinch though I'll just wash the jars I need by hand and I am good to go. 

No I meant that because retort canning basically equals pressure canning you wouldn't put jam/jelly/high acid foods in the retort bags because the bags aren't meant for water processing. I didn't mean that you can't water bath can jams/jellies etc.  It also isn't so much that the high acid kills the bad stuff (well for acid perhaps) it is more that Jams/Jellies/HAFs are always hot packed (which has killed any potential pathogens during the cooking process) and the high sugar/high acids is not an ideal growing environment. Processing then takes care of the rest so they stay that way. I'm actually going to be doing some Cherry Pie filling soon and I wanted to do some marmalade too if I can ever find the time.

I have done some Mylar/Retort sealing in my chamber machine yes and it works very well. I will say though that for Jar canning you don't REALLY have to sanitize the jars/rings/lids before filling them. The recommendations on that have changed a bit over the past 10-15 years. It used to be accepted you had do a full sanitize cycle on the jars before filling but now it is generally accepted that you only have to make sure the jars are CLEAN before filling, not sanitized. The processing of the jars (either water bath or pressure canning) takes care of the sanitizing along with the food. 

Also I am pretty sure retort pouches MUST be pressure canned, they are not for water bath canning items so you can't do jams/jellies/high acid foods in them for instance. 

On 6/8/2022 at 4:39 PM, Cheesehead_Griller said:

Great info. Thanks. 

So, my research has led me in a new direction. I think I am going to go with the JVR Vac100. Has an oil pump, accessory port, and a low-profile form factor. Reviews on YouTube seem to be quite positive. 

I own the JVR Vac100 and am very very happy with it. Even does Retort/Mylar with the special sealing bar they sell.

Looks awesome!!

@David ChangI'll have to watch that one. I've done a LOT of different variations in making mine and am always looking for different tricks and ways others do them.

6 hours ago, David Chang said:

@Jadeite this machine is excellent...

The results look REALLY even too! Did you do any rests between folds or could you manage all of the folds/turns in one round because you have the sheeter?

3 minutes ago, David Chang said:

they are in japan but i had no trouble communicating with them. you basically go to the website to select the model you want and they will email you a quote with the shipping to your location. if you are agreeable, they will send you a payment form. few days later i received the product via UPS. they have a larger model if you think you will make more than 8 pieces at a time..

Yeah I am looking at the website now (watching videos) and I actually think I'd go for the larger one for a BIG reason.. I love how the larger one folds into a little metal briefcase for easier storage. I wish I had this back in the fall!

I'm going to have to look into one of these sheeters. I got into a Croissant kick last fall and made a good.. 15 batches (and got pretty good at it if I do say so myself) but a sheeter would make things SO much easier! Taking a quick look at the website.. it looks like order these is not exactly the easiest thing in the world. How did you find the process?

I'm still hopeful that a 42" version will come out at some point.. I've wanted something like this for Tandoori chicken for YEARS when I had an Egg and never found anything that worked like I wanted to. This would absolutely be it!

8 hours ago, C6Bill said:

@DennisLinkletter Dennis needs to make those new wingnuts for the basket available as an accessory. I'd buy a 10 pack for my basket 👍

I'll second that! They look VERY user friendly!

@DennisLinkletterThere was never a plan for a 42" version of this was there?  

2 hours ago, jeffshoaf said:

I'm looking at chamber sealers now; any fresh advice or recommendations?

I understand the difference between the dry and oil pumps and know the oil pump is more better, but have any of you actually had a dry pump fail?

Any issues with using my remaining stock of the textured foodsaver material in a chamber vac machine? My sister stopped using hers and gave me her remaining rolls; she bought one of these those QVC "deals" so it's a pretty good inventory. My edge sealer is on its last leg so I won't be passing it on to anyone else.

ANOVA has recently introduced a chamber sealer; anyone seen it? It's a dry pump but relatively inexpensive and they're known for they're customer service. https://anovaculinary.com/anova-precision-chamber-vacuum-sealer/

I own and use a JVR Vac 100. I used my old Food Saver bags in it just fine until I ran out and moved exclusively to the chamber vac bags. I've been extremely impressed with how the Vac100 works and they have come out with an extra sealing bar for Retort/Mylar bags which is nice because it basically handles anything I could throw at it for any purpose

The newer models have a port in the wall that you can run your cables through. No need to pinch the cable between the lid/body/gaskets! You'll even get little silicone 'plugs' that have a cutout for cable so it helps prevent excess heat loss. The only other thing is depending on which probes you have you MAY have to buy a straight temp probe vs the angles ones so they fit through the port. I know some people have bent them to fit but I just bought straight probes (I have a Thermoworks Q so they are the thermocouple connectors. I think the 'pro' connectors fit fine though.. I can't remember). 

3 minutes ago, Wobster said:

Ok, I am convinced…just placed an order for 32” BB… now will begin the waiting…and selling other grilling stuff (keeping some…of course!) 

You won't regret it! The wait will fly by too

I had a BGE for 7+ years and even just receiving and unpacking the KK I could tell they were not in the same league. Getting mine together, seeing all the accessories and then using it I wish I had made the switch earlier or even skipped the BGE in the first place. Beyond that though the KK is also just easier to use than the BGE.

Great news! I know how frustrating it has been not being able to get that over the water.

Awesome! I think in the end you'll be happier with the larger (than you wanted) size. I originally wanted a 32" but went for the 42" in the end and I am VERY glad I did. Getting one that close to home is a rarity! Enjoy!

Awesome review!

On 8/25/2021 at 3:42 PM, ZooBeeQ said:

Is it mostly because of how backed up everything is now and it will go back to normal, whatever that is sometime in the future? Its making that used KK in general looking really good!!

While I am not Dennis.. I am in another industry which has a lot of shipping containers from overseas and funny enough on a conference I was on a few days ago the shipping container costs came up and we were informed of the new costs of shipping containers being almost exactly what Dennis said above. My supplies gave absolutely no indication or expectation that the prices will go down again any time soon. In fact we were told certain containers were actually being actively bid on and some companies were basically paying to bump other companies off ships at prices even higher than $25k.