In the market for a new cooker

[randawg]

Hi folks- Been gathering info on ceramic cookers the last couple of days. Actually, I've never heard of anything but the BGE, but I'm glad I found this site among others. I just had a couple of questions regarding ceramic cookers and the KK specifically.

1. Am I correct in assuming that for the most part, all the major ceramic cookers COOK similarly except for maybe the issue of heat retention (depending on thickness and other properites)?

2. How do people typically set up their KK for indirect/smoking? Is it sufficient to just use the heat deflector it comes with? Are there any pictures of the deflector available? How many different ways are there to set the KK up for cooking?

3. Has anyone fashioned any type of table/island around the KK? I assume that it would be infeasible to put it on a table/island due to the weight i.e. BGE, GD

4. And most importantly, how do I convince my wife the KK is worth the extra $ compared with other cookers, i.e. BGE? Originally she thought I was looking at a XL BGE, but now the KK has grabbed my attention. I'll need something good to convince her

Thanks in advance for you help/advice!

Randy

[jdbower]

Re: In the market for a new cooker

Hi folks- Been gathering info on ceramic cookers the last couple of days. Actually' date=' I've never heard of anything but the BGE, but I'm glad I found this site among others. I just had a couple of questions regarding ceramic cookers and the KK specifically.[/quote']

Welcome aboard!

1. Am I correct in assuming that for the most part, all the major ceramic cookers COOK similarly except for maybe the issue of heat retention (depending on thickness and other properties)?

The better sealed the cooker is the less airflow you need and the more efficiently the charcoal burns. This means that your food will be more moist and you'll use less charcoal. In general the biggest jump is from a steel grill/smoker to the modern "ceramics" (most of which aren't really ceramic, even the KK is a more advanced refractory material that's better than fragile ceramics), but there is some difference among the ceramic varieties.

2. How do people typically set up their KK for indirect/smoking? Is there a heat deflector of some sort that can be used for this cooker specifically? How many different ways are there to set the KK up for cooking?

How many ways can you set it up? I'll answer with the question how many things do you want to cook? There's both direct and indirect methods, with smoke and without, there's a rotisserie or on the grill - and the grills can be at multiple heights. I think you'll be hard pressed to find anything you can't cook, bake, or grill on the KK.

3. Has anyone fashioned any type of table/island around the KK? I assume that it would be infeasible to put it on a table/island due to the weight i.e. BGE' date=' GD[/quote']

You can take a look at the KK pictures forum for some examples. Since the KK is pretty tall I doubt you'll want it very high, but at ~500-600lbs once you add the meat and charcoal it's not infeasible to build something to rest it on. The KK is probably a better choice to build in over a BGE since it doesn't get nearly as hot on the outside, check out The Naked Whiz' review for details since he has both.

4. And most importantly' date=' how do I convince my wife the KK is worth the extra $ compared with other cookers, i.e. BGE? Originally she thought I was looking at a XL BGE, but now the KK has grabbed my attention. I'll need something good to convince her [/quote']

The KK isn't that horribly expensive than the other models once you start adding accessories. The KK is a single package with everything you need while a lot of the other kits are just the basic cooker with a grill. You could also say that you needed a KK because it brings out the color of her eyes - chicks dig that sort of thing

[trish]

Let her pick the tile color..... I have not used the Big Green Egg before, merely lifted the dome in a store, but in my opinion the KK is so much easier to use. The top opens so easily and that does make a difference when you are cooking. The Egg has many happy customers and in the end is capable of turning out very good food, but I have never been able to embrace the style. In the end, what is your goal? Do you want something that will produce good food, or are you wanting something that will also add style to your outdoor area?

Also, I think there is an option for sidetables with teak tops.

[Porkchop]

welcome randog! i have experience cooking with the BGE, kamado, my Komodo Kamado, and assorted steelies...

to say that price is no object would be shortsighted. however, i scrimped and saved to get my KK and would do it again, rather than buy a BGE. i'm not disparaging the BGE either; they are top notch cookers. but the Komodo Kamado is the "total package".

there are bunches of items that come stock with the KK that you will DEFINITELY want, that you pay extra for with BGE. i'm sure as you peruse the main site at www.komodokamado.com you'll notice this.

i think my favorite feature of my Komodo Kamado cooker is the spring-loaded dome. since it opens on its own when you open the latch, it leaves both hands free to handle the food going on the grill. i also consider it to be a very important safety feature. if you do get a flashback, you can just let go of the handle and the dome doesn't come crashing down like it would with other ceramics. imagine a 750 deg. fire going inside your cooker, flashing back, and then your ceramic cooker exploding into a million pieces when you drop the heavy dome down on the cooker and it shatters... not good. incidently, i don't know if you've done a "hands-on" with the XL BGE, but the hinge on the dome is probably my least favorite "feature" on this cooker. it is awkward, and moves funny.

there are other features as well; maybe somebody else will speak up on their favorites. i could spend a good long time outlining each, but then i'd feel like i'm prattling on.

[randawg]

Thanks for the input so far!

Jdbower- What are the differences between the different types of ceramic? Does it affect the cooking, durability, both or more? Also, can you adjust the level of the grates in the KK or is the height adjustment based on the different grates you can add?

Trish- My goal is to have something that is versatile as a cooker first and foremost. We're finishing our backyard and I was thinking of finishing up the patio w/ a outdoor kitchen type of thing. I was originally thinking of a nice SS gasser w/ island, but the more I thought about it, the more I was interested in a ceramic cooker. I already have 2 other smokers and a gas grill, and I want this next cooker to be the centerpiece and possibly replace 1 or 2 of my other cookers. Let me see what my wife thinks of the design and colors.

Thanks!

Randy

[randawg]

Thanks Porkchop! Please, continue to prattle I am in my "research mode" and every bit of info helps! I've only seen the Lg BGE in stores and not the XL. Actually, maybe I'm not looking in the right places, but what are the cooking dimensions for the KK anyway? I know the the grid isn't exactly symmetrical, but how does it compare to the XL BGE's cooking dimensions? I want to have a decent amount of space to cook on.

Also, can anyone detail what the typical process is when buying a KK w/ appox time between ordering and receiving? Also, I'm afraid to ask, but how much is shipping typically?

If I take the plunge with this, I probably will unload my gasser and possibly one of my smokers to make room (and justify) this purchase. The problem is letting go of them despite their flaws I hope the KK is worth it!

Randy

[randawg]

BTW Porkchop, couldn't help but notice you're from the best darn school with orange and blue. Go Illini! Beat USC!

Randy

(Former Illini now in warmer and snowless CA)

[GregR]

Randy,

I too am a former Illini now living in Northern California (Davis) . Where in Northern California do you live?

Greg

[GregR]

Also, can anyone detail what the typical process is when buying a KK w/ appox time between ordering and receiving? Also, I'm afraid to ask, but how much is shipping typically?

Dennis is currently offering free shipping on Gen II OTB cookers (I believe this offer is still in place). If not, I was quoted around $180 shipping to Davis, CA.

[Porkchop]

actually, i dont follow the illini... just not a big sports fan, but good to know another alum!

the grid space on the KK OTB is analagous to the XL BGE. to give you an idea, with the upper grill setup, i recently did 6 pork butts at once on the cooker, indirect. so, you can get some food crammed into that serious bad boy

my second favorite feature is the "fine adjust knob" on the lower draft door. makes homing in on low-temp settings very easy! gasketed upper draft is also nice. the firebox is a 2 piece unit, which allows for expansion and keeps it from eventually crumbling, like my kamado's did.

if you are new to ceramic cooking, and are used to babysitting your steelies for long cooks, you will be blown away. i load my cooker with lump, set my fire, adjust drafts, load with food, and don't mess with it until i open it up 14-20 hours later. temps stay solid as a rock. learning to use drafts to control temps has a very short learning curve. easy-peasy. it feels like cheating! a 20 hour cook is no longer a big deal, and a 4-6 hour rib cook is a snap.

once you learn your way around the cooker, you have time to relax and concentrate on your recipes, sides, tv, beer, whatever.

as far as asking the wife, i know by experience that asking for forgiveness is easier than asking for permission

[randawg]

Greg- I'm in a town called Mountain House, about an 1 to 1.5 hrs or so south of you. Glad to know another Illini here. Just talked to friends in Chicago the other day and had to rub it in a saying that I had to shovel 0" of snow while they were shoveling 8-10"

Randy

Randy,

I too am a former Illini now living in Northern California (Davis) . Where in Northern California do you live?

Greg

[randawg]

actually' date=' i dont follow the illini... just not a big sports fan, but good to know another alum![/quote']

:eek: That's ok.. i forgive ya!

the grid space on the KK OTB is analagous to the XL BGE. to give you an idea, with the upper grill setup, i recently did 6 pork butts at once on the cooker, indirect. so, you can get some food crammed into that serious bad boy

That's not bad.. Is that using 2 racks then?

if you are new to ceramic cooking, and are used to babysitting your steelies for long cooks, you will be blown away.

Cool.. actually, I don't have too many problems with my Weber (WSM), but my big smoker is a pain in the butt! I had to do some mods on it and it's still a headache to manage. The only reason I'm still hanging on to it is b/c it can fit a large amount of meat in it. Although if I get a KK I can unload it...

as far as asking the wife, i know by experience that asking for forgiveness is easier than asking for permission

I may have to employ that technique [/quote:176sqcjg]

[Porkchop]

That's not bad.. Is that using 2 racks then?

yep. 2 racks. a Tower of Pork (that's what they call me on the pro-wrestling circuit)!

Cool.. actually, I don't have too many problems with my Weber (WSM), but my big smoker is a pain in the butt! I had to do some mods on it and it's still a headache to manage. The only reason I'm still hanging on to it is b/c it can fit a large amount of meat in it. Although if I get a KK I can unload it...

yep, the ol' "minion method" works great on the WSM or a tricked out ECB. what's the other cooker you got? bet its one of those offset jobbies. got it tuned and sealed up with fireplace rope? you are in for a treat with the ceramics, boyo! a good gust of wind makes temps drop like a stone with those steelies, even the WSM. does nothing to a ceramic.

I may have to employ that technique

you didn't hear it from me!

[randawg]

what's the other cooker you got? bet its one of those offset jobbies.

I have a Brinkmann Smoke King Deluxe or BSKD. It is an offset design that I got from my local Menards. There are numerous issues with it. First off, the metal is too thin so keeping the heat in the cooker is near impossible. I added firebricks all around and yeah, a gasket of some sort is needed for the cooking chamber. Secondly, I needed to make a makeshift metal thingy to direct the heat from the firebox to the middle of the cooking chamber or the heat would run up one side more than the other. Thirdly, the components overall are cheap! Everything is either rusting or falling apart in some way Oh well... the only thing that sort of appeals to the caveman in me is the fact I can place split logs in it. Not efficient, but kinda cool, until I have to baby it again 30 min later...

[trish]

Randawg....Show your wife side-by-side pictures of a nice tiled unit and the green egg....I'll bet she picks the tiled unit. Also the classic design is available by special order and it is a symmetrical design. The KK can be color coordinated to fit nicely into your new area....The Green egg only comes in one color that I am aware of.

There are a couple of interior ledges on the inside of a KK for different grill heights, and the sear grill can double as an upper grill. You can get a gas assembly for the KK and I believe Tony cooks over his gas sometimes. You really won't need the gasser if you get a KK. The webber type smokers will definitely not be needed as the KK is so much easier. This will be easy enough for your wife to operate without you....She may even challenge you to a 'throwdown'.

The current promotion for free shipping is a good deal if an inventory colors suits you.

[randawg]

Trish- Already told the wife about it and showed it to her and she totally agrees that this is way better than the "green". She also said she would want to choose the colors so it went with our patio. Man.. just like you said.. Thanks

The caveat is I have to sell 1-2 of my current cookers and I have to be ABSOLUTELY sure this is what I want... i'm almost there....

[jdbower]

Jdbower- What are the differences between the different types of ceramic? Does it affect the cooking' date=' durability, both or more?[/quote']

I think of the BGE as ceramic, very thin but also brittle. THe KK is an improvement on traditional ceramics in that it blends the best of ceramic properties with the durability of a more solid construction. Dennis says it better than I:

Refractory Materials - Not Ceramic - The material used in a ceramic grills' body is of the utmost importance. Ceramic by definition is a hard brittle material. In contrast' date=' Komodo is not ceramic—not fired and brittle. Harbison Walker is the world leader in materials designed for high temperate applications. Their engineers helped design, engineer and develop a two-layer sandwich of a dense inner layer and a lightweight outer insulating layer. During use, Komodo's often reach 800° F. The inside material is capable of withstanding temperatures of 2200° F. It holds and reflects the heat. The insulating layer keeps heat in and reduces its loss resulting in fuel economy. Wall thickness varies from 1.5" to 2.0", not including the additional thickness of the firebox sitting inside. Testing found that with little fuel, this design achieved cooking temperatures very quickly and efficiently. It is quick and easy to adjust and stabilize the temperature. [/quote']

Other cookers ignore the ceramic-like benefits and have gone for pure thermal mass, the theory that the bigger and heavier a cooker is the more stable it is. This works well for brick ovens, but I like the KK's hybrid solution best.

Also' date=' can you adjust the level of the grates in the KK or is the height adjustment based on the different grates you can add?[/quote']

It's a rule around here that we need one mod without a KK so I have to wait for someone to step up, I had to take the job after DJ had his delivered. Honestly, I'm trying to build a house and it's been going slowly so I'll let someone else verify, but there are three standard cooking positions (the main grill, a lower grill, and you can use a stand to create an upper grill). If this isn't enough, a fairly handy person should be able to easily create additional stands for cooking higher than the main grill or hangers for cooking lower.

[ThreeDJ16]

It's a rule around here that we need one mod without a KK so I have to wait for someone to step up, I had to take the job after DJ had his delivered.

Actually there is Majestik too.

there are three standard cooking positions (the main grill, a lower grill, and you can use a stand to create an upper grill). If this isn't enough, a fairly handy person should be able to easily create additional stands for cooking higher than the main grill or hangers for cooking lower.

Actually four as the upper grill can be flipped and converted into a sear grill right on top of the charcoal. I cannot imagine a need for any more grill surfaces or positions as that pretty much covers all the space available in the kk.

-=Jasen=-

[Farmer John]

My only way to get a new KK when I had another one was to get my wife involved. Hey it may be red but it sure is a nice new KK that works better than any thing I have ever used. Heck I even call it hers but she has never used it!

John

[randawg]

Well, my wife seems to be going w/ it! She also likes the Dark Terra Blue with dark grout. So, we'll see what happens....

Randy