charcoal question

[kerry_sf]

Hi there, I'm relatively new to the KK and was wondering if there is anyone who might have a recommendation about what seems to me to be an overly smoky flavor. Part of the problem is that I'm a pescetarian (veggie + fish), and don't eat any of the meat that reflects this flavor well.

Another problem is that I bought 80 lbs of Lazarri mesquite instead of hardwood lump on the last trip. I'm sure this imparts even more smoke flavor, but I still feel the hardwood overpowered even our pizzas, let alone the fish. (And the mesquite isn't a subtle smoke flavor at all.)

I had the most amazing black cod ever cooked in a ceramic cooker, so I know I should be able to make something similarly non-smoky tasting.

Could it just be the Lazarri brand has a strong profile?

I was also thinking that maybe just using approximately the amount of charcoal needed (we always top off the basket to begin) might help.

I haven't tried extruded coconut charcoal yet, but that seems like overkill for everyday cooking.

Any thoughts?

Cheers,

Kerry

[primeats]

Mesquite has a very pronounced flavor that is imparted to anything that is grilled over it. Check out the Naked Whiz's website( Nakedwhiz.com ) for an in depth review of most charcoal varieties. Try using another natural lump charcoal, the flavor should be that of cooking over an open campfire. Good luck.

[kerry_sf]

Mesquite has a very pronounced flavor that is imparted to anything that is grilled over it. Check out the Naked Whiz's website( Nakedwhiz) for an in depth review of most charcoal varieties. Try using another natural lump charcoal' date=' the flavor should be that of cooking over an open campfire. Good luck.[/quote']

I've checked out Naked Whiz. I think the discussion about burn time and ash content is useful, but don't recall seeing any rating to describe how much smoke flavor it leaves. He only does Lazarri mesquite lump, and the problem I found is even when I used the Lazarri hardwood lump (non-mesquite), the flavor was too strong to taste any wood chip flavor, if used. Idk if this is Lazarri or just me! (NW graded Lazarri Mesquite "above average" and called the mesquite flavor subtle... not my experience.)

Hmmmm.... My husband bought some lump from Whole Foods to give another brand a shot, but everything going on today's q is meat, meat, meat. It won't be a fair comparison.

[tnt]

Kerry,

I'm not a big smoke lover either, I do like the flavor it imparts but too much is just that too much.... I started with Lazarri hardwood lump and did not like it. I tried wicked good stuff and it is "Good stuff" someone gave me a bag of Lazarri orange and it was good. Other than that we both need to hope that Dennis finds a way to get his extruded coconut charcoal shipped in and when he does I'd tell you to buy a pallet load of the stuff. It's absolutely amazing, burns long, produces very little ash, and has a very light smoke flavor. The best charcoal I ever used.

Tony

[jdbower]

For an idea of how subtle the extruded coconut is I've made a cheesecake with it. I don't use it about 350F or so, but then again I don't do veggies often. For that I use Cowboy lump from Costco and it gets the job done.

Another piece of advice is to make sure you burn at temperature for a while, if there's white smoke you're still releasing a lot of volatiles into the cooking chamber, let it burn at temperature for a while and most of the water and strong stuff will burn off.

[Syzygies]

I'm also Bay Area. I buy eight 40# bags of Lazzari hardwood lump at a time from the warehouse near SFO, to complement my hoard of extruded coconut lump. Hardwood for high temps, coconut for low & slow.

My main complaint about the Lazzari hardwood lump is lots of small crumbs I can't use; I have to screen the ends of bags for usable charcoal. But at the price, hard to complain. They claim I can bring back crumbs for credit; I never have.

We think the mesquite has a much harsher flavor. However, my Thai cooking teacher, also in the Bay Area, insists that mesquite is closer to the correct flavor for Thai barbecue. Her protocol is quite precise. Start a measured quantity of lump in a chimney, and leave in the chimney for a specified interval (50 minutes, 75 minutes) till just before use. Then spread embers and grill. Her embers are fully developed, with not the faintest trace of black charcoal left unburned.

Having moved from a K7 to a KK, the KK is better insulated, making this more of an issue even with hardwood lump. One does not want fresh, raw, black charcoal starting to burn in the presence of food. The taste will be off.

This is the Achilles' heel of all ceramic cookers, for low & slow barbecue. Correct, classic technique involves two fires; one moves fully developed embers to the food cooker, only when they are ready. In a different thread, I described a Chinese L-shaped grill, whose purpose for street vending was to insure a steady pipeline of fully developed embers. It takes charcoal of extraordinary quality to burn black charcoal in the presence of food without creating off flavors. Extruded coconut lump is such a charcoal; so are the finer Japanese charcoals. "Fully" carbonized is a crux issue.

As for others not liking the taste of Lazzari hardwood lump, I'd have to watch the technique. I detest the taste of mesquite lump, but the barbecue was remarkable in my Thai classes, if I meticulously followed my teacher's technique.

[mguerra]

To amplify and expound on Sys' remarks; get the charcoal really burning before placing your fish. You can do this in a charcoal chimney, once that charcoal is really raging and has burned down a little, then dump it out in to an EMPTY charcoal basket. If you dump it out on to unlit lump, you will then start the unlit lump in to it's beginning, smoky phase. Or, to keep the lit lump from falling through the basket, dump it out in to a grilling wok, one of those four sided, slope sided things, and set that down in the charcoal basket. Now you have a hot fire, with none of the coals in their starting phase, and a lot less smoke. Give the mesquite to someone who likes it, for brisket. I can't get enough of the stuff, myself. I've got about twenty pounds of mesquite tar built up inside my KK! Or, better yet, just cook up a bunch of briskets with it and give them to family, friends and co-workers. They will love you for it.

[kerry_sf]

Thanks so much for the replies, they're very helpful. I wanted very much to try with a smaller quantity of charcoal because I felt we were probably dealing with some partially unlit lump (my KK's joint custodian wasn't so interested in my theory... well, well, well.) The charcoal we used this time (from Whole Foods) seems to be a lot better (or at least a lot more forgiving), so I think part of it is the mesquite thing, and part of it is just Lazarri. Some of the "lumps" that come in the 40 lbs Lazarri bags are small tree trunks, they probably just take a long time to get completely lit.

I'm not sure we're giving away the mesquite just yet, but I can say the difference in smell during the cook is huge. Our KK is 100' from the door to our house and we always had to make sure it was closed during a cook because otherwise, the house smelled pretty strongly of smoke. The new charcoal was fine with the door left open for the husband's pulled pork burn last night/this morning.

Maybe I will try the mesquite once more on a pizza night, and use somewhat uniform sized pieces, leaving them even longer than usual before raking the coals. Maybe I'll convince the husband to try this approach with one of his meat creations... (yeah right)

Thanks again for all the help!

Kerry