Krusty K Posted June 14, 2008 Report Share Posted June 14, 2008 First - Let me say I am have an 8 year old K7. Never had problems other than band adjustment, always had attentive and prompt customer service. Second – I admire the Dennis’ design and execution. Beautiful, and certainly they are the current ultimate in ceramic, thick wall design. Dennis took the potential that existed in the basic concept and made significant improvements in every aspect. That being said, what am I going to buy if I want another smoker or if for some reason my K7 falls apart? The answer is NOT another K or KK or Egg or K type unit, but a Traeger wood pellet grill. Blasphemy, well let me explain. I have a friend who can afford what he wants and is pretty connected B to B wise, I’ve catered for him and made the best pork shoulder he’s ever had. And that is probably surely, and truly past tense. He got a deal on a Treager 075 w/digital control – I mean like 50% of list. He is not a student of BBQ, but he saw a good deal and without an axe to grind in the grill game, bought it. So he called me up yesterday and wanted me to consult on finishing a cook of a packer cut beef brisket which had be going for about 18 hours. Too make a short story long, his first attempt, his first low and slow, produced as good a brisket as I’ve had and much better than I’ve ever done on my K7. What did he do? Basically he set it and forgot it. No adjustment, no compensation, no nothing – set the f’in digital thermo to what you want, set you probe to monitor internal and leave it the f alone. Maybe this is a rush to judgment. So I’m asking myself, other than relatively unique and beautiful ceramic lawn ornament or deck adornment, why do I want or need a ceramic cooker? You can get this 075 Traeger w/digital option for about $1250 shipped. I holds at least as much as my K7 – but without the need to use an upper grill and without the need to remove all the meat to add lump, etc. This is not meant to be anything other than a think piece. This pellet thing is a good rig. Maybe, it can’t cook a pizza, but if you’re buying a ceramic grill to cook pizza…..well…… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheNakedWhiz Posted June 14, 2008 Report Share Posted June 14, 2008 Well, I'm buying a ceramic grill to do everything. Smoke cheese at 90 degrees, make pizza, sear steaks, make paella, bake, etc. I can only deal with so much butt, brisket and ribs. And I'd bet you'll have a hard time getting that pellet pooper to flashback! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanny Posted June 14, 2008 Report Share Posted June 14, 2008 Sounds familiar You know, that sounds familiar... I have a similar thing at my house. Set it and forget it for hours and hours, if I want. I don't have to twiddle with a temperature dial or an upper grill, or anything. I can do meat in it, of course, but it's just as good for bread, or pizza, or vegetables. And it's got a very generous capacity. I've even done entire meals in it at the same time. Like your friend's, it has no lump or coal to light, or anything, and nothing to shovel out after a cook. I never have to remove any of the parts to add fuel. In fact, I just clean the grates now and then. Ok, hardly ever. It's called an oven... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulR Posted June 14, 2008 Report Share Posted June 14, 2008 Pardon my ignorance but here's my 2 cts (I'll research pellet rigs a bit later) but my main choice for the ceramic cooker was diversity (as the Whiz commented) it can cook from low and slow all the way up to charring steaks in under 1 minute... It also is economical from a "shutdown" point of view compared to my kettle/wsm. And I really really like the tasted of charcoal based cooks. Then there was the boss approval rating; she didn't mind a goodlooking BBQ (yes it looks great) instead of another metal beast on the deck. Don't want to sound too much like a fan-boy but if I could only have 1 BBQ I would go with the KK. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naldo Posted June 14, 2008 Report Share Posted June 14, 2008 No Searing--No High Temps? If I remember correctly, my frend had a Traeger--though I don't know what model. You're right--with a digital unit and by the way the Traeger works, it requires the least amount of effort. However, it also ages and I'm not sure it's something that would last a "lifetime"--as opposed to a KK, for example. The other thing, and more important I think, is the fact that is pretty much just a smoker and not a fully functional grill--such as a KK. As far as I know, and I could be wrong--about the highest temp you can get is about 400-450 F. This would mean another actual BBQ next to the smoker, unless that temperature works for you. Personally, I love smoking foods, as well as quick-grilling dinners, and I've seen pellet and owned a ceramic cooker for years, and I've never even considered the pellet option. I think it's a personal choice really--it depends what you are looking for out of the cooker. For me it's about the interaction, the great range of things you can do with it, and, of course, the great fascination people have when they see a ceramic cooker in action---plus it's REALLY COOL! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conodo12 Posted June 14, 2008 Report Share Posted June 14, 2008 Krusty K - I hear ya!! But before anyone jumps to conclusions, let me tell my tale... So, I have had the pleasure of cooking on a KK, a Caldera TallBoy, and finally a Stumps Smoker. I had each unit for at least a month and played with them all. At the end of the day this is what I found: 1) The KK does it all. Bake, Sear, Rotis, Grill, Low 'n Slow, Smoke, Make Jerkey (even roast coffee?!?!) - everything! And it is insulated so you can cook during the Northeastern winters. 2) The Tallboy Rocks. If you like Low 'n Slow, it will take care of you. Yes, you can grill and sear, but a bit of a pain as you have to lean down to do that work. No Rotis. Lastly, it is not insulated. You could cook in the winter, but you will use LOTS of fuel (without the insulated, heat-resistant cover that is). Lastly, LOTS of space in a Tall Boy. Definitely not a "single subject" cooker! 3) Stumps Smoker - Got this one right now. I have to hand it to Stump - this is the King of the set it and forget it. Easily get one hour of cooking per pound of fuel @ 250 or less. More if less. No reason for a Guru on this guy (new model GF-223) it just holds the temp for days. But - No grilling over hot coals - it's impossible as it is indirect cooking. No Rotis. Cooking in the winter - oh yeah - it is insulated like no one's business so you can cook whenever and wherever you like. This one has more room than any of the units I mentioned and is the choice for lots of guys on the competition BBQ circuit. So what is my point(s)? Simple - The most versatile cooker is the KK. Notice I did not say ceramics. The KK is the only unit that I am aware of that does the Rotis. The other units I mentioned will get you into the winner's circle - certainly. But if you want to replace your existing low 'n slow, replace your gas grill, and replace your rotis, the KK is it for backyard cooking. And because it is insulated (and sealed when shut) you can cook in virtually any outside temperature and get the same smokey results. No "flavored" pellets here! Whatever you go with - please have fun. This is a great forum and one that welcomes all! Thanks for your post! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThreeDJ16 Posted June 14, 2008 Report Share Posted June 14, 2008 Maybe this is a rush to judgment. I agree with that part.... Bottom line....I owned a Traeger and sold it to get into ceramics. Before the Traeger I was on my way to get a BGE and someone side swiped with promises that the Traeger never delivered on. Owned it about a year, sold it, went forward with ceramics and never looked back! First off the pellets are aggravating. Any moisture and you get a mess in your feed hopper or auger feed mechanism. So they do not do well unprotected in rainy environments or high humidity. Second, every pellet tasted exactly the same......I tried them all but never found the taste of that particular smoke pleasing. Would much prefer to control my own smoke and flavor as I know what is being put in then (read several places they use the base wood ....alder... and only a percentage of the actual wood listed in making the pellets). Really sux running out of pellets too; hard to run down to any local store and buy pellets. The expense is greater verses charcoal (any comparisons they try to give are not based against low and slow with a ceramic). The controls were very rough.....it would never hold temps as even as ceramic. If I achieved 25 degrees around a setpoint it was a good day, usually wider. The controls only stop and start the auger feed and do not change the fan speed.....so very course and not responsive to temp changes. Sure, you may think your setting and forgetting, but actually monitor and you would see a swing. A ceramic and a Guru knock these controls out of the water. Being mine KK setup is a 90 second light and a set/forget I don't see to much difference in ease. I also know the pellets do not last near as long as one load of charcoal (I had the 0075...maybe they increased the hopper but I doubt it). Used to have one reload on cooking shoulders with a Traeger and my ceramic no reloads needed. Lets not forget insulation. In cold weather the Traeger burned almost twice as many pellets to keep the same temps. No insulation equals quick thermal loss and wildly swinging temps to try and keep up. This is the real kicker to me, the only thing the grill does well (and that is loose) is low and slow. Forget any high temp cooking unless you just like roasting. Even removing the heat guard you cannot sear (even built custom mesh screens trying). It might of had more room on one level, but it was not even cooking. You still have to move meats around. No great features there. Seriously, if you are going to consider something like this....at least check out the Cookshack cookers. They use the same type feed auger and controls, but at least they are insulated. Your gonna get what you pay for and the Cookshack is more. Honestly, I don't think anyone reading this forum is looking for the cheapest alternative or they would not be considering a KK to begin with........ -=Jasen=- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amphoran Posted June 14, 2008 Report Share Posted June 14, 2008 My sister has a traeger with the new digital controls, and I recently was with her while she cooked all day with it. The big thing I noiced was that there was a LOT of airflow through the unit, and I asked her about low and slow. Her response was that it really dried the meat out if you tried that, except on the "smoke" setting, and that the smoke setting required constant vigilance because it went through pellets so fast. Don't get me wrong, she likes her machine, but she mostly cooks shorter and hotter. She's going to get her first look at the KK on the fourth of July, and I'm looking forward to her thoughts on the comparison. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThreeDJ16 Posted June 14, 2008 Report Share Posted June 14, 2008 Don't see this post being relevant to the ceramic general section.... So the only place I can see it would be appropriate is in a related products area under Traeger. Moving.... -=Jasen=- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krusty K Posted June 16, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 16, 2008 Moving Since this is about a ceramic vs and non-ceramic it looked ok, maybe I missed burying it in the correct place -does the move seems to be an RJ sort of thing, well not really since it would never see the light of day over there. The post brought out a lot of things and certainly my friend, who now has a nice dry place for his pellets (he was keeping them in the pit by his sump pump), learned a lot about how these product-centric forums work. He is the better for it, having today, Father’s Day, actually run out of pellets in the midst of a shoulder cook. His dealer - about 40 miles away, came to rescue and left some sitting out for him to pick up. If I would have just posted early in the week he’d have known not to run out of pellets. BUT what is most important is any thing that gives any BBQ cook more information is worth reading. You never know where the next great tip will come from and while I think diversity is generally overrated, in BBQ it really helps everyone involved. Some of the comments were a little inane, but mostly either very helpful or right on the point which is everyone has a different reason for picking a cooker. My friend got a $2000+ cooker for about $600. Not sure you can touch it for that. I suspect a nice KK and guru is $2000 or more. Regarding the comment on ovens – I guess that if you could produce grandchamp BBQ with a nice home oven there would be teams using them on the circuit. And if you’re after rustic for rustic sake, join the chuck wagon circuit…..and I hope you’re making your own lump and don’t rely on that unpredictable store bought stuff. What about that Tiger!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanny Posted June 16, 2008 Report Share Posted June 16, 2008 Re: Moving Some of the comments were a little inane... Never know when that sort of thing might happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThreeDJ16 Posted June 16, 2008 Report Share Posted June 16, 2008 Post edited......taken subject to PM.... -=Jasen=- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChefJeff Posted June 16, 2008 Report Share Posted June 16, 2008 In the past 2 years there was a period where I too thought that maybe the Traeger was my future. I can obsess like nobody's business over technical stuff, and within all of the various on-line information out there, I found that Traeger pellet grills occasionally would get jams within the augur system, and that sometimes the pellets wouldn't feed into the heating chamber. I also learned that within the Traeger grills, there is a hierarchy. Traeger has different models within their line of grills, and some of them were more prone to pellet jams. My second epiphany---well maybe not an epiphany, because I'm only quoting from a friend. A woman I know, used to own a barbecue/fireplace store here in Sherman Oaks. Within the past 6 months, she sold the business, and she is now an employee as opposed to owner. She LOVES the stress free life of being an employee---ooops, I digress. Anyway, the new owners of the company have a very large lineup of all sorts of cookers now. My friend's report on the Traeger (that they now sell), is that the food cooks in an environment where a lot of moistness to the product is lost. This gal really knows her cookers, and has told me to stay away from Traeger. I have no personal reason to knock this type of cooker at all. I'm a fellow who raves about my infrared gas grill, and also my sealed metal electric smoker. My forthcoming K.K. will be yet my THIRD type of outdoor cooker. Nothing wrong with having multiple cookers---It just won't be a pellet grill in our family. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wheatridge Posted June 18, 2008 Report Share Posted June 18, 2008 I bought a Traeger last year when we became empty nesters. I wanted something like a posk3 to go along with my posk7. We chose the Traeger because it would be easier for my wife to use just turn the knob. And I discovered the KFForum. It's okay for chicken and ribs. Did a turkey and a lo and slo butt. Everythink was fine except steaks and burgers. Unless temps are in the 90-100+ range you can't get it to 450 degrees which is about max. We enjoy T Rex style med rare steaks and they are very dificult for me on the Traeger. I'll keep it but the temps vary wildly with the seasons. Winter on smoke is about 90 degrees. Summer 200-220. Bottom line. I'm still saving for whatever latest and greatest OTB edition Dennis has available when I've saved enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leejp Posted June 18, 2008 Report Share Posted June 18, 2008 Here's why... Recognize the picture? It's on the KK Homepage. That's my baby... This during a Northeast Ice Storm. One does NOT need a KK to make good que. But it does help... especially during the extremes. Just need heat and smoke... Ever see Alton Brown's terra cotta pot smoker? Why waste $$$ on a Treager even? http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl= ... l%26sa%3DN Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wheatridge Posted June 18, 2008 Report Share Posted June 18, 2008 No doubt their isn't any question about kk being the best KKooker on the planet but everything in context and with a smile. Lets see I bought a posk7 with all the trimmings + a guru (the last bbq I'll ever buy. They have a lifetime warranty you know, ceramic and all that.) for around $2200. I can't wait until I haul my posk down the canyon and dump it because that means my new OTB is forthcoming. Really not to make any kind of statement but by then I will have spent over 5 grand maybe close to 6, on ceramics. And they are wonderful kkookers, I do so willingly. But I also know that many who spend $600 or so on a Traeger will think I'm nutters. Crikey I think I'm nutters. Is their rehab for BBQ? Cheers Larry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leejp Posted June 18, 2008 Report Share Posted June 18, 2008 But I also know that many who spend $600 or so on a Traeger will think I'm nutters. Crikey I think I'm nutters. Is their rehab for BBQ? Cheers Larry My wife thinks I'm nuts and she has no idea what a Traeger is even. I value useful things I value beautiful things My Komodokamado is both... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
