Emulating Wood burning pizza ovens with KK

[laguna_b]

I understand how I might make a pizza with a KK and charcoal. What I don't understand is if and when one would use wood to supplement or replace the charcoal to give the taste of a wood burning pizza oven.

One difference is that the wood burning oven has the wood off to the side with most of the smoke going up the chimney w/o impacting the pizza directly. Also it is 100% of the heat source.

If I were to use wood in a KK it would saturate the area of cooking from below. Perhaps that might produce an undesirable effect.

Has anyone ever tried these approaches. If so, what kind of wood did they use and how? (and how much?)

Thanks!

[mk1]

Re: Emulating Wood burning pizza ovens with KK

Using wood is STRONGLY not recommended.....see owners manual

[laguna_b]

Re: Emulating Wood burning pizza ovens with KK

Hi Mk1,

There is a lot to learn from the owners manual and while I read it a couple of times, indeed I forgot about that....

Exchanging email with beckbilt about how to get the flavors w/o the actual heavy wood. So far the most practical is the dutch oven with holes in the bottom on the charcoal.

Thanks for your heads up....glad I didn't use any yet.

Barry

[tony b]

Re: Emulating Wood burning pizza ovens with KK

FWIW - I just built the 2 qt dutch oven as a smoker box. Only used it once so far, but I did like the results. I do need to practice more with the dough sealant, though. Mine was too gummy and hard to work with. Just like making bread and pasta, it's all in the tactile feel.

[Syzygies]

Re: Emulating Wood burning pizza ovens with KK

I came up with the 2 qt Dutch oven after many experiments, some failed. I tried cooking only with wood, wrong idea unless one has a separate starter fire for making embers away from the food. I tried making my own charcoal: The gases leaving the chamber eventually create enough heat as they burn to maintain the fire that makes the charcoal. This lead me to the design of the smoke pot.

In my experience the smoke pot effect is best at lower temperatures, below 300 F. Above 300 F one starts to get a runaway self-sustaining flame, like making charcoal. And the intensity of the flavor, while always more subtle than open wood, gets out of hand at higher temperatures.

For making pizza, the first rule of any equipment is "it is what it is". One doesn't heat a house with fake fireplace logs. How does one make the best pizza in a Komodo Kamado? In my experience, I find I want a very stable target pit temperature, ideally so I'm cooking as much as I can with radiant heat. Then, all of the play is in the quality of the dough. Dough is infinitely variable and a lifelong obsession. One can only say one has mastered dough as a way of saying one has given up trying to do better.

There's an eGullet thread Modernist Cuisine Baking Steel with some insightful commentary on the differences between ovens, including ceramic yard ovens. Bottom line, our heat source is below, and that's what we've got to work with. There are also instructions on making one's own baking steel. As a future experiment, I'm tempted to have made a round steel disk to go on the upper grill, above pizzas on my main grill, for a very black, close up radiant heat source from above. But of course, this is overworking the problem. Focus on the pizza itself.

[kad1979]

Re: Emulating Wood burning pizza ovens with KK

I have had amazing pizza results on the KK. For me it is about 2 things. The dough (like others have said) and the temperature. Anything under 600 degrees is not much different then using your oven. It is not hot enough to get a nice crispy crust. I have found that 650-700 is the ideal temperature for me.

[normstar]

Re: Emulating Wood burning pizza ovens with KK

I've only done it once, but top grill with 600 some temp was perfect. At 700, it burned before it was fully cooked.

[tony b]

Re: Emulating Wood burning pizza ovens with KK

Hey, Syz, can you give me the rough proportions for the flour paste. I tried it for the second time yesterday and still struggled with the consistency. Too gummy/sticky to pipe out of the zipbag easily. Just goop'ed it on the lip of the oven lid and smooshed it down.

Also, I was doing baby back ribs at 225F for 4 hours. I didn't seem to get much smoke from the smoker pot. Today, I opened up the dutch oven and most of the wood was still unburned, only slightly brown, with a couple of smaller pieces turned to charcoal. I had made a well in the charcoal basket for the smoker pot, and put the Coco around the outside in a ring. A double handful of small pieces of lump in the chimney for a starter. I'm wondering if the oven didn't get hot enough to burn the smoking wood because of not enough direct contact with the burning Coco on the outside? There was no burning charcoal under the bottom of the smoker pot, it was resting directly on the bottom of the basket. Thoughts/suggestions??

[Syzygies]

Re: Emulating Wood burning pizza ovens with KK

Hey, Syz, can you give me the rough proportions for the flour paste.

...

the smoker pot, it was resting directly on the bottom of the basket. Thoughts/suggestions??

The flour paste is as thick as possible while well mixed and able to extrude through a nicked corner of a ziplock bag. While getting the hang of it, mix in a cereal bowl? The whole idea is to avoid convection.

The smoke pot should rest on the fire. Ideally, at first the fire is entirely under the pot, so all heat also is applied to the wood within. When I light using a MAPP gas torch, I aim the flame under the smoke pot, to get it hot too.

(I love MAPP gas. They scent my home gas line so I can detect leaks, and it smells like the dog passed wind. Do they scent MAPP gas? It smells like Italian white truffles.)

[tony b]

Re: Emulating Wood burning pizza ovens with KK

Thanks for the helpful tips. I had pretty much guessed that I should have put the smoker pot on TOP of the fire, not in the center. Glad to know that I was on target with that one.

I'll just keep playing with the dough (would that be Playdoh?) Both times that I've tried it, the dough was just very sticky and would not cooperate easily. I just ended up spackling it onto the pot lid and smooshing it down to make the seal. I'm pretty sure that both times, I got a good seal. It's just a cumbersome, messy process. Practice, practice, practice!

[laguna_b]

Re: Emulating Wood burning pizza ovens with KK

I liked the dutch oven idea but dealing with sealing it just seemed a bit laborious. So I bought a conventional vented smoker of iron and put wood chips in it tonight. I put water in and let it soak for about 20 minutes. Then I drained the water and put it upside down on the coals to duplicate the dutch oven effect. No results yet, just started it up. Any comments or experiences doing something like this?

[mguerra]

Re: Emulating Wood burning pizza ovens with KK

Soaking the wood with water prior to smoking has no effect. The wood doesn't start smoking until the water has evaporated out. The water in the wood absorbs heat in the process of vaporizing in to steam. Like "searing in the juices" and basting a turkey, soaking wood chips is a myth busted.

http://www.amazingribs.com/tips_and_tec ... _wood.html

But it doesn't harm anything! And it throws a little extra moisture in to the cooking vessel, although we don't think we need that in a KK.

[carriesanaxe]

Re: Emulating Wood burning pizza ovens with KK

What are you using to put holes in the bottom of the Dutch oven? I do not have a drill press. Is there something else I can use?

[laguna_b]

Re: Emulating Wood burning pizza ovens with KK

This is the reason I chose to use the Brickman or similar, wood chip box since you can invert it on the coals and avoid the messing around with flour pastes... It seemed to work fine but then I am not sure if my fine is what others seek....perhaps the dutch oven is still better..... I would love to see others comments. My solution may save you from figuring out how to drill out the dutch oven.

[tony b]

Re: Emulating Wood burning pizza ovens with KK

What are you using to put holes in the bottom of the Dutch oven? I do not have a drill press. Is there something else I can use?

I did it with a simple, cordless drill motor. Cast iron is actually a soft metal and easy to drill.

Used mine again this past weekend (3rd try) and I am getting better at the flour paste. Also made sure to put the oven on top of the coal. Better results this time.

[trudeto]

Re: Emulating Wood burning pizza ovens with KK

A year or two ago, someone posted about a stainless steel cooking pot by MSR, that has a spring locking lid. I bought one, drilled holes in the bottom, and use it as a smoke pot now. It's called the MSR Stowaway Pot.

I know myself, and i knew that i might spend an hour or two (or three) trimming, injecting, brining, tying and otherwise preparing meats for my KK, but I knew that i would NOT make dough every time i wanted to use a smoke pot.

So, I toss in a couple of chunks of smoking wood, put a piece of foil over the top, place the lid on the pot, and close it with the spring latch. it may not be absolutely airtight, but it seems to work just fine. If i were to do it again, i would drill the holes in the lid, and put it on the fire upside down, then any minor leak there might be, would also be directed downward into the fire. Here's the link to the pot I got, its about 1 1/2 qts. I have used it dozens of times, and other than the discloration stainless steel gets from expossure to heat, it is doing fine. i will admit, though, that i have not used it for a high temp fire like needed for good pizza. For that, i just put 2-3 pieces directly on the fire. The temps are so hot, that the wood lights quickly, and smoke burns off, leaving just the fast burning wood, which to me, imparts enough wood fire flavor, without overpowering the pizza. good luck. VRTom

http://www.rei.com/product/601897/msr-s ... pot-1600ml

[mguerra]

Re: Emulating Wood burning pizza ovens with KK

That would be a great pot, undrilled, to cook with in the KK! I keep a number of vessels that I only use to cook in the KK.

They get black and nasty and I keep them away from the regular kitchen stuff.