Low and slow on a ceramic help please

[LarryR]

After my first low and slow cook on a Ceramic I realize this is a different animal than I'm used to and what applies to my WSM may not apply here.

I started my cook with a full basket/ring of Rancher Natural Hardwood Charcoal (unlit) and 8 - 10 lit briquettes laid on top of the unlit. I then assembled my cooker; put the clay saucer in, deflector and grate on. Then put my ribs on on and shut the lid. I opened the bottom draft door about 1 inch and the top damper about 5 full turns. She came-up to temp (225 grate) slowly, about 3 degrees a minute. Around the 1:30 mark I had temps stabilized at about 223 grate. Bottom door was open just a sliver and top damper maybe 1 inch turn from closed.

She stayed at 223 - 226 for about another hour then the temps slowly started climbing. I couldn't close the draft door but took the top damper down to "barely" open. Temps continued to climb. By the 3:30 mark I was around 265. By the end of my cook, 5:30 temps were at 278. Keep in mind these are grate temps, my lid temps were in the 300's.

I couldn't have closed anything down any more without completly closing it. So with this not being an option here are a few things that I think could be the cause.

1. Rancher burns to hot. However I've used it for quite sometime and had excellent temp control. Doubt this is the issue.

2. Started with too much lit. I think this could have contributed to my temp issues. Maybe I should take it down to 4 or 5 lit.

3. Did I take the temp up too slow, too fast?

4. Do I need a larger heat sink? I'm using a 14" clay saucer directly over the fire.

I'm going to be doing a butt (or two) this weekend and would really like to keep my grate temps around 225 - 230. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance.

[Duk]

Was your lid latched shut all the way??? there are two positions---just a thought---also , you can't take it up in temp too fast--my setting for 225 is an inch open on top and just a sliver open on the bottom damper

[Conodo12]

My guesses would be the following -

I agree with you on point #1 - not the Rancher

Maybe started with too much lit. Scale back to 3 or 4 lit and let it come up to temp slowly.

Too fast.

I think the heat sink is fine. It is actually more of a deflector. I'd have to see a pic to be certain.

Finally, check your cooker for any air leaks. In particular, make sure the bottom seals up air tight with the exception of your draft adjustment. Seems like there may be a leak somewhere. Double check your lid by using the dollar bill test. Close your lid on a dollar bill at the back, right of your cooker. Now pull out the bill. It should pull out with some resistance. Continue the complete distance around your lid with this test to check for gaps. If you can slide that bill around in any spot, you need to make a lid adjustment to get her tightened down.

Hope this helps!

[Amphoran]

Are you sure that the gasket is tight? I've seen leakage around the lid gasket keep my temperatures higher than desired. Another possibility is that there is some other source of air into the cooker low down - does it have an active guru port? I found that having the guru's damper shut about halfway resulted in a minimum dome temperature of about 300 by natural draft.

On the subject of rapid vs slow heating up - there can be a dowside to coming up rapidly - if you overshoot, it takes a ceramic a lot longer to cool down than it does to heat up.

My normal procedure for a low and slow is to fill the basket and start three points with the torch until they're just barely glowing. I then open the top damper several turns and open the door damper to about twice as wide as I would have it to maintain temperature. Usually in about 20 minutes I'm sneaking up on the setpoint, so I close down the top damper to about an eighth of a turn open and set the lower damper to its final position.Let things heat soak for another half hour or so and make any final tweaks as I put in the butts.

Cheers,

Mike

[trish]

Larry, has an older K7 so there is no latch like on a KK. Larry, I think you started with your dampers set too high and let it come up too fast. When I did the low cooks (I never really thought it necessary to be under 250) the bottom damper was only ajar a sliver, and the top barely open as you described. I'm not familiar with the fuel product to comment on its properties or whether you started too many.

I will say in the beginning I had trouble getting it low enough just because you don't think 3 or 4 pieces are enough to get to 250. You'll get it, allow plenty of time to react to an adjustment, other wise you will overshoot the target temp, and it takes forever to lower the temp once it is heat soaked.

[LarryR]

A little smoke will escape from the lid on the right hand side but very very little not enough to mess with the temperatures (in my opinion).

This weekend I'll start with less lit, 3-4. Bottom open a sliver and top open just barely, say 1 inch from closed. I'll let her come to temp very slowly. Bottom open a sliver and top open barely.

I'm wanting to get manual operation down and then I'll be connecting my Stoker to her and let Stoker worry about air flow.

I'll be doing a couple pork butts on this cook. One the infamous Mr. Brown and the other Chis Lilly's Six Time World Champion Injection and Rub. It will be interesting see how they do on the the K. I'm expecting a much higher moisture content. Should be a fun cook.

Thanks for all the input.

[Conodo12]

"A little smoke will escape from the lid on the right hand side but very very little not enough to mess with the temperatures"

Larry, a leak is a leak. You want to create an environment where air from below the coals is the only air coming into the smoker and the only exhaust is from your damper top. This way, there are only two variables to manually control when dialing in your temperatures. If smoke is escaping from your lip, you can rest assured that air is being sucked in as well.

The good news is that with a lid adjustment you could be all fixed up. Use the dollar bill test to ensure you have a good seal. Worse case, you may have to play with your seals once you are sure that the adjustment in the lid is ideal.

One other tip - The Stoker or Guru can mask this issue. Because you have the bottom draft being completely controlled by the power-draft, and your top damper is just barely cracked, it will overcome SOME imperfection in the lid seal. You will see smoke coming out of the lip a bit more aggressively with the power-draft, but the fan usually can compensate for very minor leaks. This will get you to your desired lo 'n slo temp. as long as you don't over light your fire from the beginning.

Let us know how you make out!

[johnnyboy]

Larry, Please allow me to really confuse you

I'm of the "get er up to temp fast" group!

I typically shoot for 50 degrees higher than the cooking temp I want. I try to get there as fast as possible. Then make hat and door adjustments. But, I know my door hat positions, for whatever temp I want.

It's after adjustments, during heat soak phase, I get the 50 degrees back. Just seems to work for me.

Here's how I do it:

1. Re-fill the basket full every time.

2. Open hat and door wide, wide, wide.

3. Ignite coals with the gas attachment.

4. At 50 degrees F. above target I shut her down.

5. Then set hat and door for desired temp.

6. Never open the lid until I get to desired temp.

Note: Hat adjustment seems most important. Remember, you can shut down a grill with the door open. I try to come close to matching vent/door openings, but always less exhaust going out than fresh air coming in.

Best of luck!!

[LarryR]

Thanks for all the input. Johnny, what kind of fuel are you using?

Going for low and slow again today; doing butts overnight and I'll be using my Stoker to monitor (not run) the cooker. I'll let you know how things turn out!

[LarryR]

Revised lighting on butt cook

Starting with less lit definitely did the trick. I also started my cook with the damper and draft door positioned where I thought the "final" cooking position would be. This seems to have worked, however it took very long to come-up to my target temp, 1:50. I only made two minor adjustments prior to going to bed last night and that seems to have kept her in the 225 - 250 range I was shooting for. I used my Stoker to monitor temps but not run the cooker (see graph below).

What's interesting is I'm sitting at 175 right now and by looking at the graph it doesn't appear that I've experienced a plateau just yet, could come later in the cook I suppose but I was wondering if this is common in a ceramic.

Haven't opened her up just yet but she smells wonderful. I ended-up going with only one butt as I figured if I screwed this up at least it would only be one piece of meat. Haven't opened her up since I put her on but as I said it smells great! I'll keep you posted on how she turns out.

[Sanny]

Well, dunno. I DO know that my last low and slow (two boneless butts in a K5) at 225 range took close to 24 hours to cook. Yup, took over an hour to get up to steady heat, and I started by lighting only a couple places (with wax/sawdust fire starters). Like you, once coals were lighted I set the dampers to the final temp settings, and walked away.

I think even a few degrees more (250 and above) shortens the cook considerably. Just my opinion. But think about it - at 225, the fire's not that much hotter than the 190 or thereabouts final temp of the meat, right?

Tasted good, though, and everyone was happy. Even had some recipe requests! Go figger.

[LarryR]

Well the fewer lit was the trick. Had no problem maintaining sub 250 temps. Did have to make a couple of adjustments once the sun got up this morning but it was much easier than my previous attempt at low and slow. Highest she got was 249 grate.

I was amazed by how much fuel I had left over after 18 hours off cooking. Probably could have gone another 15 hours and if I had to guess I probably started with only 7 lbs of fuel . . . this is only a guess though. I easilly have more than 1/2 of a 20 lb bag left.

Next time I'm going to try and bring her up a little faster (not much) with the same amount of lit.

Thanks again for all the input!

[johnnyboy]

Thanks for all the input. Johnny, what kind of fuel are you using?

Typically lump, but works with extruded too.

[Conodo12]

Glad to hear the low and slow worked out for you! I was a bit concerned about the lip area leaving smoke out.

You've posted some great pics! Keep it up! Makes waiting for my KK a little less painful!