Second Cook: Brisket on Gator

[Karolina Komodo]

Well, thanks again for helping me get through my first cook last weekend.  Maybe ambitious, but I have planned to do two briskets for guests for Saturday night.  Luckily, I have plenty of vacuum sealed Q from last weekend in case it doesn't go as planned   I have read through many of your previous posts to learn as much brisketology as I can.  A few quick questions:

1.  I have on hold 2 prime "whole briskets" and plan to trim them down.  Is that the right cut?

2.  Should I brine?

3.  Should I rub the night before as I did the shoulders?

4.  I need to have them ready for guest Saturday by 7.   When do you think I should put them on?  My plan was to cook at 250-275, wrap in the butcher paper at some point, let rest wrapped in cooler at some point (all learned from your posts of course).   Proposed schedule:  brine overnight tonight, rub in the morning, put on around 11 tomorrow night which will give me 16 hrs to have ready.  Too soon?  Open to any suggestions.

5.  I know most of you go for a certain probing "feel" but is there an approximate temperature you like?

6.  Is there a stall with brisket at 250 like the shoulder had?

7.  From my previous post, some mentioned the difference in the cyber temp of 220 and the tel-tru of 250 was possibly the grate level vs upper hood level temp.  Thoughts?  Should I test them in boiling water?  Go with the cyber one since that's the level of the meat?

Thanks ahead of time for your help with cook #2, will keep you posted.

Eric

 

[5698k]

First, I don't think brining beef is necessary, particularly prime briskets. Rubbing the night before is a good idea though. What rub are you using? How much do your briskets weigh? There's no way to guess a time without brisket weight. Your basic butcher paper plan is a good one, plan on wrapping at approximately 165° internal, this is about when the stall is. Once done, you can start probing around 190°, but most often brisket is probe tender around 200°-205°, make sure your temp probe, and your tenderness probes go in the flat, the point will be tender way sooner.

How much do you plan on trimming? I like to remove all hard fat, including between the flat and point, but I do leave the fat cap alone. The more fat you remove, the more rub will be effective, plus the hard fat has no flavor benefit.

I'm guessing you're planning on indirect cooking. Set your cyberq at 275°, and let that ride. I like to cook fat cap down, but this is an infinite subject of discussion. Cook and wrap as stated above, and plan on roughly 1 hr/lb.

I like a simple 50/50 sea salt, black pepper rub, or you can search in this forum coffee cardamom rub, I don't use the oil. Keep it simple, feel free to ask more questions, there are lots of seasoned brisket cookers willing to help.

This is how I trim briskets.




Rob

[billg71]

Don't wet brine! Just do as @5698k advised and you'll do fine. You can dry brine overnight or use your rub if it has salt in it. More on dry brining here: Amazing Ribs: Dry Brining, Easier And Less Wasteful Than Wet Brining

And go over to YouTube and watch Aaron Franklin's playlist on brisket, the man knows his stuff.

Happy smoking!

Bill

[tony b]

I basically follow Aaron Franklin's brisket method (except I like more spices in my rub). No need to wet brine (dry brine is OK the night before). If you have full packer cuts (point and flat), it will take a bit longer to cook than if separated. Leave about 1/4" fat on top to keep it from drying out too fast. Wrap in pink (non waxed) butcher paper after the stall is over (typically around 170F IT), shoot for 203F IT for final temp. You can wrap in foil, a beach towel, and store in a good insulated cooler for hours before serving, so err on the side of starting earlier vs later. Cooking time is more tied to thickness than weight. Like I mentioned earlier, if you separate the point & flat, it will cook much faster than if left whole. For me, a flat will cook @ 275F in about 6 hours. YMMV.

[Karolina Komodo]

Thank for the pointers...pun intended.  Do you guys have cook temp you like for brisket?

[5698k]

I cook at 250°-275°.


Rob

[Shuley]

I have always cooked mine at 225. The next one I do I will experiment with 275. If that's what Aaron Franklin does....its probably the right thing lol. I'm so excited to get to taste his brisket in about 2 weeks!

[tony b]

I'm soooo jealous, Shuley. I've never been to Austin, but a TX BBQ tour is on my "bucket list." 

I've done just about all the techniques - Low & Slow (225F), Hot & Fast (325F), and all points in between. They all work fine. 

[Karolina Komodo]

Thanks all, shooting for 250 I think.  Taking a loooong time to get kk up to temp this time, would it be ok to plug in the cyber fan to get up faster or does that risk overshooting?  Thx

[5698k]

Plug it in, just make sure your top vent is barely cracked open.


Rob

[Karolina Komodo]

Thx Rob, turned on for 10 min to get a boost now off at 170 so I didn't overshoot, 2hrs to get there.  Learning curve in effect....hope to get the startup time to temp down on future cooks, maybe add some non coco charcoal?  Thx for the help buddy

[Karolina Komodo]

Another thought is I am only able to fit one layer of coco char in center of basket with more on edges to be able to fit the smoke pot under drip pan so maybe not lighting surrounding charcoal as would if stacked?  

[5698k]

When I'm lighting for a lo/slo, I light in one spot, hook up the cyberq, and let er rip. You simply don't need a large amount of coal lit at any one time. If you're trying to speed up the time to temp, open the top vent more to allow more air, but close it back down when you get within 25° ish. The cyberq won't overshoot temp as long as the top vent is closed enough.


Rob

[Pequod]

@5698k-Do you also close down the fan damper a bit or leave it open? Haven't tried my CyberQ with the KK yet, but would be good to know.

[5698k]

I leave mine open, but mine is isolated from wind. If you're dealing with wind, close by about 1/2.


Rob

[tony b]

+1 on Robert's suggestion. My KK is in a windy spot, so when I use the Guru, I choked down on the fan damper to compensate - 1/2 on a normal day, 1/4 open on a really windy day. I've had the wind cause the temps to overshoot and the Guru is basically worthless at that point. 

[ckreef]

I guess I just don't see a need for a controller with a KK. I get plenty of piece of mind with the KK alone. 

Just did a long low-n-slow with Prometheus (16.5"). For 15 hours it stayed rock steady at around 230* and that was with me opening the  dome once an hour for about 30 seconds. Never touched the vents once. 

After 15 hours I started tweaking the vents open to slowly raise the temperature in an attempt to finish the cook and eat dinner at a resonable time. 

 

[5698k]

There is no "need" for a controller on a KK, but it's a really nice thing to have.


Rob

[tony b]

I only use mine on the real long cooks (> 4 hours), just a security blanket is all. 

[Karolina Komodo]

Well, Saturday's cook was a real humbling experience.  After the butts the weekend before and thinking I was a bbq  master, the brisket reminded me I've got a lot of learning to do.

The brisket ended pretty tender and flavorful with good smoke but VERY dry.   The cook was mostly at around 150 degrees but I overslept past the stall and didn't get them wrapped (butcher paper) until internal temp of 185.  I pulled them off at around 200 and 195 degrees each then put in a cooler wrapped to rest.  I was done earlier than planned and they were in the cooler for about 5 hrs before serving.

I am guessing wrapping too long after the stall was the reason for being so dry?  Other reasons I've pondered:  I trimmed too much fat?  I didn't spritz during cook (although I did baste before wrapping in butcher paper)?  Rested too long?  Should have taken off earlier?

Anyway, was still fun and appreciated by all just was hoping to represent the KK as it deserves.

Thanks for all of your tips before and during the cook and certainly open to any thoughts on what I did wrong.

Eric