Sharky Posted March 11, 2019 Report Share Posted March 11, 2019 13 minutes ago, jonj said: Okay, MacKenzie. Amazon just dropped off my IMS E61 Precision Group Shower Screen so I had to try it out. For @Sharky, this now makes the third tweak to my R58 (red Cafelat Silicone gasket, VST basket and aforementioned shower screen). I just had the best shot I have made with this machine. I'm very happy right now (and wide awake). Thanks MacKenzie! Jonj. That’s really encouraging, I can’t wait for my upgrades to arrive! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacKenzie Posted March 11, 2019 Report Share Posted March 11, 2019 jonj, that is great news. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pequod Posted March 11, 2019 Author Report Share Posted March 11, 2019 Some new VST baskets arrived today. Also ordered a Niche Zero grinder out of the UK which has 63mm conical titan burrs, is getting excellent reviews, and also much more affordable than the Monoliths. I’m out of control. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacKenzie Posted March 12, 2019 Report Share Posted March 12, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Pequod said: I’m out of control. Too much caffeine will do that to you. Edited March 12, 2019 by MacKenzie 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharky Posted March 12, 2019 Report Share Posted March 12, 2019 Niche Zero looks really interesting - looking forward to user review. It’s funny how you are (self-confessed) out of control in your quest to be totally in control of producing the perfect tiny dose of coffee.... 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pequod Posted March 12, 2019 Author Report Share Posted March 12, 2019 Forgot to mention the 3D printed parts I have on order to build a drip tray that integrates my Bluetooth scale. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonj Posted March 12, 2019 Report Share Posted March 12, 2019 Okay, now that is truly worthy of an “out of control” flag! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharky Posted March 12, 2019 Report Share Posted March 12, 2019 2 hours ago, Pequod said: Forgot to mention the 3D printed parts I have on order to build a drip tray that integrates my Bluetooth scale. @Pequod. This implies that you have a 3-D model of your coffee corner and grinder!? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pequod Posted March 12, 2019 Author Report Share Posted March 12, 2019 8 minutes ago, Sharky said: @Pequod. This implies that you have a 3-D model of your coffee corner and grinder!? 3D model of the drip tray assembly, but not mine. There's a DE1 user in Australia who is remarkably prolific with mods and add-ons for the machine. 3D printed drip tray assembly (with integrated scale), 3D printed tablet stand, has composed more custom profiles than Mozart did Piano Concertos, even a custom skin for the tablet. Pretty sure he doesn't have a job. Anyway...I'm using his design and having 3dhubs print it out for me. This will integrate the scale BELOW the drip tray, both protecting it from excess drips and preserving headspace for larger cups. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharky Posted March 12, 2019 Report Share Posted March 12, 2019 Of course, I remember now - you’re measuring the yield of espresso in real time not the ground coffee from the grinder. I guess you weigh that too? I have to say your Aussie friend seems to take obsession to a whole new level - the Obiwan of Obsession! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pequod Posted March 12, 2019 Author Report Share Posted March 12, 2019 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Sharky said: Of course, I remember now - you’re measuring the yield of espresso in real time not the ground coffee from the grinder. I guess you weigh that too? I have to say your Aussie friend seems to take obsession to a whole new level - the Obiwan of Obsession! I single dose, weighing the beans in. Used to weigh the beans out, but am using a low retention grinder, and will get even better (I hope) with the Niche Zero. Definitely weigh the shot yield in real time. Edited March 12, 2019 by Pequod 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacKenzie Posted March 12, 2019 Report Share Posted March 12, 2019 Oh no, now we need a 3D printer to make our espresso. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pequod Posted March 12, 2019 Author Report Share Posted March 12, 2019 1 hour ago, MacKenzie said: Oh no, now we need a 3D printer to make our espresso. Only if you wanna run with the cool crowd! 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
franciscusj Posted March 13, 2019 Report Share Posted March 13, 2019 This is a reaction to the espresso from au.Playtime with Decent Espresso DE1+ (part 2) August 18, 2018 - Uncategorized Continued from part 1… So what can it do and how is it to use? The good… John’s goal in the build brief of this machine was to make one machine emulate all and in this sense, huge progress has been made. Want a hand operated piston leva? Yes. Slayer emulator? Yes. Flat 9Bar? Yes. Spring leva? Yes. Flow profiled to your spec? Yes. Pressure profile? Yes. These are just some of the capabilities in an espresso sense and the machine comes well loaded with lots of profiles to get you started. There is little that the machine cannot do with espresso and the possibilities are really only limited by your imagination. There are so many YouTube clips out there, that there is not much value in repeating them. Do a search, watch some and then come to your own conclusions. I got great espresso out of the box with very little adjustment: So, it pretty much does what it promises for espresso. I played more and produced many other great but different espressos as well as pretty much everything else on the black and milky coffee menu. The not so good… Mindful of the fact that the DE1+ represents almost $5k if you’d like to own one in Australia, what do you have to live with? The finish needs more work. I just can’t get beyond the fact that when I look at it, I can’t see $5k. I actually struggle to see $2.5k. At this point, it’s taking many hands 20+ hours to construct one of these and I suspect that much of the cost of purchase is labour coupled with R&D. If I didn’t know what I was looking at, I’m seeing an appliance store machine with an android tablet attached. I doubt that someone who doesn’t know what s/he’s looking at would walk into your kitchen and say “WOW!” It’s noisy. How noisy? Not Sunbeam jackhammer, but it grunts, vibrates and groans. This makes is hard to close your eyes and imagine a $5k machine. Steam? Well, plenty of it and it will texture milk adequately. Steam quality? Decidedly average. The steam is a lot damper than I’d expect. At this stage, this is the item that needs the most work. Nitpicking? Probably- but it should be better… Service? No surprise that it takes 20 hours to build one. Other than replacing a pump, I wouldn’t want to repair one! At the moment, if something goes wrong, Decent will send bits if required and then try to help you fix the issue. In many states of Australia, it’s illegal for you to do that without formal electrickery qualifications. What will happen if/when someone is injured? If you can’t fix it, you send it back and it’s either repaired, or replaced. Discounted factory refurb. anyone? What else? For me, the biggest frustration is that no matter when you received your Decent Espresso machine, you scored a superseeded one. Decent are continually involved in the R&D process. The next build of DE1+ machines will have revisions to the group and also to the heaters. Sadly, it seems that for the moment, you will never have the thrill of the latest and greatest as that will be the next machine built, not the one shipped to you. In conclusion: Will it be replacing the machine at home? Sorry, but not at this point. In my home, great coffee is a given. It’s served with the wow factor that comes with a beautifully designed, high performance and pretty expensive machine and I am happy with that. My traveller is and will remain an Olympia Cremina. It’s simple, superbly built, produces amazing espresso and will last forever. Whilst the Decent software interface is brilliant and I have no doubt that other manufacturers will be watching closely and may well be already looking to emulate it, you don’t need all of this technology to achieve brilliant coffee and I suspect that for many owners, the novelty will wear off and it will be set pretty much to each owner’s preferred default and stay that way. Many of us just want fantastic coffee before we head out the door and all of this technology will still not cover for poor skills. If anything, it highlights poor skills. The DE1+ will appeal to a very small percentage of coffee geeks who have the time and means to play with coffee and do so extensively. Sadly, there are not many with that luxury on a day to day basis. I can taste $5k in the cup, but I need to feel and touch it. Aspects of the machine are brilliant, but it’s just not the right machine for me…Where’s the romance? Postscript: Our DE1+ was offered for sale and was sold late in August. The purchaser of the machine played with it for a few weeks and has also offered it for sale. He’s decided to purchase a La Marzocco GS3 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pequod Posted March 13, 2019 Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2019 (edited) ...and yet the coffee continues to be excellent. No doubt the DE1 is one of the most polarizing machines out there. Just a cursory glance at HB and you’ll find haters (LOTS)...and over the top fanboy enthusiasts...and not much in between. The traditionalists prefer the “art” and wizardry, and the DE1 takes a lot of that away. Now we have data! For every review like the above, there are multiple others that are polar opposite. I actually agree with the first two bullet points above. But I wanted a high end machine with small footprint. Tain’t pretty, but it works. The sounds it makes? Yeah...they’re weird. So what? That grinder next to it is practically shouting high decibel obscenities every time I hit the switch. The next two aren’t quite accurate. Since things are constantly upgraded with firmware and app upgrades, if it isn’t good now, it soon will be. Users simply need request, and it happens. Have seen this multiple times on the DE forum already (including a steam tweak), and I’ve only owned one for two weeks. There’s also a pro steam wand option that user tests show reduces the steam moisture by quite a bit...entirely in the users control to purchase and install. I have one but haven't installed it yet, mostly because the stock wand seems to be more than adequate to me...I enjoy the texture I'm getting and, maybe I'm too ignorant to tell, but don't notice excessively moist steam (especially compared with my previous machine). John Buckman is a lot like Dennis...actively a part of his community of users, and incredibly responsive. Thus putting the lie to the last point. Early adopters have been sent free upgrade kits to keep their machines up to date. Not to mention the continuous stream of firmware and app updates, AND a lively community of users sharing 3rd party upgrades, profiles, etc. Again...think Dennis like service and user community. BUT... I agree with the reviewer that it isn’t for everyone. If you prefer to preserve the mystery and art of espresso, no shame in staying analog. If you’re an engineer (guilty!) or just want to learn more than you thought you ever would about what makes a good cup...the DE1 is a contender. Sometimes more data isn’t better, and it does add to the workflow, because each shot also comes with the desire to analyze the data. Definitely not for everyone, just like a KK isn’t for everyone. Nothing wrong with that. But also nothing wrong with enjoying it if that's your cup o' joe. Edited March 13, 2019 by Pequod 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ckreef Posted March 13, 2019 Report Share Posted March 13, 2019 I'm desperately trying to ignore this thread but for some reason I keep right on reading. Death by espresso? That would be when Mrs skreef killed me after I spent that much on an espresso setup. I barely survived the WFO purchase - LOL 1 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pequod Posted March 13, 2019 Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2019 37 minutes ago, ckreef said: I'm desperately trying to ignore this thread but for some reason I keep right on reading. Death by espresso? That would be when Mrs skreef killed me after I spent that much on an espresso setup. I barely survived the WFO purchase - LOL Truth is, you CAN make good espresso at home for under $1K for both grinder and machine. You'll just be limited to medium and darker roasts and to what you can achieve. I had a Gaggia Classic (~$300) paired with an Orphan Espresso Pharos (~$250) for 3 years and it was GREAT...as long as I didn't want anything more than Redbird Espresso (which is an awesome comfort blend far better than any chain coffee shop). The Classic simply needs three teensy weensy upgrades to make it suitable: 1) Replace the steam wand with the wand from a Rancilio Silvia (easily purchased and installed after market). 2) Recalibrate the OPV to 9 bars (the stock setting is 13 bars for some mysterious reason). This requires a portafilter fitting pressure gauge, but I happen to have one and would be willing to send to you if you went down this path. 3) Install a PID to replace the stock bimetal thermostat. This will allow you to precisely control your water temp (bimetal thermos swing wildly, making them unsuitable for espresso). This is available as a kit from Auber. With that...you'll be off and running. Just accept you'll be dropping another $5k in a few years... 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lannoos Posted March 15, 2019 Report Share Posted March 15, 2019 I ordered my Niche Zero in January and expect that it will be shipping any day now. I told myself if I ordered it, i would forget about it and be pleasantly surprised when, months after it was paid for, it magically arrived at my door. The "completely forgot about that" part of my plan was never realized, but I do so hope it shows up soon so I can satisfy my need to see just how bad the 89 dollar grinder i use today really is! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pequod Posted March 16, 2019 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2019 14 minutes ago, Lannoos said: I ordered my Niche Zero in January and expect that it will be shipping any day now. I told myself if I ordered it, i would forget about it and be pleasantly surprised when, months after it was paid for, it magically arrived at my door. The "completely forgot about that" part of my plan was never realized, but I do so hope it shows up soon so I can satisfy my need to see just how bad the 89 dollar grinder i use today really is! Wow! $89 grinder to Niche Zero. Go big or go home! Mine says shipping in April. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonj Posted March 16, 2019 Report Share Posted March 16, 2019 I am looking forward to reports on the Niche Zero. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
