MsTwiggy Posted February 13 Report Share Posted February 13 (edited) Hello, I am posting here to introduce myself and show off my new 23 Ultimate. I live in Seattle WA and thus far I have made pork ribs, roti chicken, and a pork butt. The food has been very good!! Edited February 14 by MsTwiggy Added finished ribs pic 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MsTwiggy Posted February 13 Author Report Share Posted February 13 And I have a question about charcoal and filling the basket. I want to do a low and slow cook for a brisket - the last time I cooked I filled the basket to the top of metal with lump charcoal and only got 10.5 hours of cook time with the 5.6 pounds of charcoal that fit in the basket at 230 F. In the photo below you will see that I have a little more room to get to the top of the firebox. Should I just dump charcoal in to get to the top of the firebox? Is there any risk to the Kamado in going higher than the firebox? Going to tag some folks that I know have answers (from another forum) and see if they respond to me here @Pequod, @CeramicChef, @DennisLinkletter. Is the only way to get the longer cook time to use the coco char? Thanks everyone I appreciate your comments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dono Posted February 14 Report Share Posted February 14 Welcome to the forum. Nice grill. And your cook pics look great! What lump you are using? I own a 32 BB so I can not speak to the limited cook time at such a low temp. But it does seem out of the norm to me. Concerning your question about adding more charcoal…I wouldn't see a problem topping it off with a little more lump like you described. Dennis told me once that there is nothing you can do to damage the firebox with wood or charcoal. Not a lot of help, but I’m pretty sure @tony b as well as others have the 23. So maybe they can chime in with some info. Welcome again. I know you’re going to love your KK. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MsTwiggy Posted February 14 Author Report Share Posted February 14 Hi @Dono thanks for your kind words. I used Blues Hog hardwood lump for this cook. It was a fresh bag. Appreciate you tagging folks that can speak to this. Adding a photo of the pork butt that was my first cook. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dono Posted February 14 Report Share Posted February 14 Looks awesome! Hope it was as good as it looks. I’ve not heard of Blues Hog before. Coco char is a really great charcoal. For my taste, it works better with the addition of wood chunks to get a smoke flavor. You might experiment with it and others. Some brands I’ve used and had success with are Komado Joe, Jealous Devil, and Fogo super premium (yellow bag)…..not necessarily in that order. The only lump I recommend anyone avoid is Cowboy. It’s the worst in my experience. You may be doing this but I suggest lighting a grapefruit sized portion of lump just a little bit north of middle. Again, I’m sure others will chime in with some other helpful recommendations. Best of luck. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacKenzie Posted February 14 Report Share Posted February 14 @MsTwiggy Welcome, great looking KK and those cooks look wonderful. I would fill up the basket with lump. After the cook is done and you shut the vents down the fire soon goes out and you will have lump left for your next cook. You will just need to stir it up and top it off with more lump. Remember once the cook is done and the fire is out set the lid clasp so that the dome is not squishing your gasket. There are two settings for the dome one is tight for the cook and the other for resting between cooks. It relieves the pressure on the gasket which will make the gasket last a lot longer. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tony b Posted February 14 Report Share Posted February 14 (edited) Welcome to the Obsession, @MsTwiggy! All good advice from those above. Not much that I can add. I primarily use Jealous Devil as my go-to lump these days. I have a local shop that carries it, so I don't have to deal with shipping costs, like with Kamado Joe (Amazon) and Fogo. Both are good lumps. If you want to check on any major lump charcoal, I highly recommend going to naked whiz's website. He tests various brands for quality. He's well respected. The Lump Charcoal Database -- Naked Whiz Charcoal Ceramic Cooking He thought that Blues Hog was a good charcoal, btw. His only major complaint was that there was too high a percentage of "small" pieces in the bag that he tested (66%), which is quite high. If your bag was similar, then that could have been a source of why your cook didn't last longer, as obviously small pieces burn up faster. Review of Blues Hog Premium Lump Charcoal -- Naked Whiz Ceramic Charcoal Cooking As far as I know, there's absolutely no harm in overloading the charcoal basket. Good luck with the brisket and post pics! One of our key "rules" on this Forum - No pictures, it didn't happen! Edited February 14 by tony b 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MsTwiggy Posted February 14 Author Report Share Posted February 14 (edited) Thanks @MacKenzie that is a new suggestion to leave the Kamado slightly ajar, haven’t heard that before but will give it a try. It doesn’t seem like there is much compression of the silicone gasket so I am a little surprised at this recommendation. @tony b I have used Fogo, B&B oak lump, and the Blues Hog none if them have lasted. I am aware of the nakedwhiz charcoal site snd have found it to be super helpful. Most of my cooks are low and slow which is why I bought this Kamado as I wanted a cooker that would keep going with stable temperatures, in Seattle it just doesn’t work well with thin walled metal equipment when is raining. One thing about the small pieces burning faster - Dennis has mentioned repeatedly that charcoal burns at the maximum volume for the allowed airflow so I am not sure why a smaller piece would burn faster. If anything the smaller pieces should have less void space between them, thus greater volume of charcoal, and burn longer. Has anyone gotten more than 10 hours of burn time out of a full basket of lump charcoal on an Ultimate 23 running at 230 ish ??? If so are you filling it beyond the top of the firebox? Thanks! Edited February 14 by MsTwiggy tagging members Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syzygies Posted February 15 Report Share Posted February 15 6 hours ago, MsTwiggy said: Has anyone gotten more than 10 hours of burn time out of a full basket of lump charcoal on an Ultimate 23 running at 230 ish ??? Many of us won't know, because for low & slow cooks we used extruded coconut lump charcoal. It's poor-mans Japanese binchotan charcoal, if you know what that is. Komodo Kamado makes the best extruded lump, but I also enjoy Than Charcoal as an alternative, a bit less neutral in a way that reminds me of roadside Thai barbecue. Komodo Kamado's coffee charcoal, when available, is the single best lump charcoal I've ever used. If you're cooking for restaurant investors, pull that out. There are many ways to look at ordering KK charcoal. People go for pallet shares (group orders) which is a great way to meet people in the clan, but there's no actual definition of a "full pallet". Try different orders, e.g. 12 boxes, to see how shipping works out, and just go for it. Or order a few boxes of Than and save it for low & slow, if infrequent. It kind of depends on your price sensitivity. I've always found that a poor memory is the best way to get past spending money. A heretical point of view would be to buy high quality briquets, with no filler that changes the lump taste. I love all Fogo lump charcoal choices, and I've recently started buying their briquets. They're denser than lump, and the uniform geometry also helps with getting to 550 F for pizza. KK COCONUT SHELL AND COFFEE WOOD CHARCOAL Than Charcoal, Chef's Choice Premium Grilling Charcoal, Log Style, 22lb Binchotan White Charcoal FOGO BRIQUETS (2 BAGS OF 15.4LBS) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syzygies Posted February 15 Report Share Posted February 15 Yakitori Kono, New York City Here's some binchotan in the wild, at my favorite restaurant in this hemisphere. I've been three times. He gets better. He spent six months researching chickens before finding a Pennsylvania farmer that supplies the restaurant. Best chicken I've ever tasted, including Japan and the SF Bay Area, e.g. The Local Butcher Shop. The kappo-style yakitori omakase is $175 per person, but one can get into serious trouble there ordering sake and bonus skewers, in an enthused state where one loses all reason. Go for beer and just the prix fixe, and have just as good a time. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffshoaf Posted February 15 Report Share Posted February 15 (edited) I generally get well over 12 hours cook time plus several hours of preheat time at 225°F and have lump left using B&B in my 23" - and I've been known to pull the charcoal basket out to fill it so the lump wasn't much of the top of the basket. Where are you measuring the temperature? If you describe your lighting process, vent settings, etc., we may be able to help you. KKs are so well insulated, it doesn't take a lot of fuel to keep them at that temp. Edited February 15 by jeffshoaf 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MsTwiggy Posted February 15 Author Report Share Posted February 15 @jeffshoaf Thats great to hear that you get long run times out of B&B lump. I have access to that lump charcoal, Blues Hog, Fogo, and Masterbuilt/KJ locally. I have ordered a box of the coco char to see if there is a huge difference in burn time using it. I am measuring the temperature of the pit at the hinge grate. This would be one grate higher than the lowest grate and not the riser grate that would be used for baking with a stone. I placed a single tumbleweed in the bottom of my basket in the center, covered entirely with charcoal to the top of the basket and lit the tumbleweed from the underside using a torch lighter and then place the basket in the Kamado. I pull the bottom vent door ajar and leave the lid open for 15 min. Then I shut the bottom vent door and set it to the biggest hole and half of the dial on the left. I open the top vent so that it is about 2 inches from shut. This runs at 230 indefinitely as measured on the top grate. I have a brisket and anticipate needing to cook for at least 18 hours at 230. When you do low and slow do you use the bottom grate? @Syzygies Do you use to cococchar because you prefer the flavor or becuase it consistently burns longer? I am not opposed to using it but ordering single boxes is not very economical and ordering greater quantities would require storage. I have the space but would worry about it getting moist and unusable over time as it's pretty humid where I live year round and my garage is more like the ambient condition than inside my house. That looks like a fun dinner at Kono! Thanks everyone for your input on my post!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syzygies Posted February 15 Report Share Posted February 15 1 minute ago, MsTwiggy said: Do you use to cococchar because you prefer the flavor or becuase it consistently burns longer? Flavor. I built storage in a shed that's definitely ambient. California is wet some, mostly dry, and I barbecue more in dry weather. Of course "there must" be a humidity effect, storing charcoal, but you should directly experiment to find out how pronounced this is. My belief is that the effect can be too faint to worry about. You want a load of charcoal for low & slow to burn like a fuse, and the hot fire dries out any residual moisture in the nearby charcoal as it progresses. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffshoaf Posted February 16 Report Share Posted February 16 I think your issue may be lighting from the bottom. I use the Weber paraffin cubes and either put 2 right next to each other tucked down into the lump on top of the basket (with basket in place in the KK) or I'll light just a minimal amount of lump in a charcoal chimney and then do it on top of the charcoal in the basket (again installed in the KK). Using the cubes in the basket has failed a few times with the lump not getting started well but I don't recall the chimney starter method ever falling. My vent regimen is similar to yours unless I'm using a temperature controller. I used a weed burner torch to light the lump for the 1st few years of. KK ownership but I'm pretty bad at keeping a spare can of fuel on hand. I use the paraffin cubes to start my other outdoor cookers (Weber kettle, big Santa Maria/Argentinian grill, insulated gravity feed smoker, plus a new offset stick burner that was delivered just yesterday) and can get them next day from Amazon, so I almost always have them on hand. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Chang Posted February 16 Report Share Posted February 16 @MsTwiggy hi and welcome. i also light a wax starter from the bottom floor of the kk for low and slow. this is not what most people do to start charcoal but it works for me. i can only speak of the 19TT, but i get very long slow and low burn times on a full basket using lump charcoal. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptMorg82 Posted February 16 Report Share Posted February 16 Welcome neighbor! I’m up in Mukilteo with a 32” Autumn Gold Pebble. Reach out if ever interested in a charcoal share order. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrandyr Posted February 16 Report Share Posted February 16 (edited) I have gone for 12 hours in a 21" at 225°F using B&B extruded, with almost half the basket left at the end. I was using a Fireboard controller. I made a point of starting just a couple of bits of charcoal (with a Looftlighter) and as the temperature started to come up gradually limited the fan speed to 5%, so the fire never got too big. I have not mastered just setting the vents by hand. The charcoal in the box of Cocochar I received was wrapped in plastic, for what it's worth. Edited February 16 by wrandyr 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tekobo Posted February 16 Report Share Posted February 16 (edited) Welcome @MsTwiggy. Great name. Wish I had thought of using MsPiggy when I first came on the forum! I live in UK near the sea and it can be pretty damp here. I buy pallet loads of charcoal and cocoshell briquettes and have kept both for years without any issues. The charcoal is in an open cellar with water dripping in (I catch it in a trug so it never hits the paper bags that the charcoal is in) and the briquettes are in boxes in a wooden shed. I have no issues with lighting either and no worries about damp lump. I have exactly the opposite lighting technique to you. I light the fuel at the top, making a small well in the middle to either receive isopropyl alchohol soaked lump or a wax lighter, and I close the lid. I keep both the top vent and the left bottom vent fully open during the initial lighting process but I never bother with the small holes on the right except when trying to maintain a low and slow temp. I am not sure about keeping the lid open for 15 minutes while lighting. My expectation is that the chimney effect created by having the lid shut is actually more efficient for lighting the lump and for building up the heat in your KK. It is worth experimenting with different methods to see what works best for different situations. Soooo much fun cooking over fire. Welcome again. P.S. Good to have reached out to @Pequod. I miss him! Edited February 16 by tekobo 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonj Posted February 16 Report Share Posted February 16 I have a KK23 and a few years ago smoked two pork butts for 23 hours with one basket of lump. It was mostly an experiment to 1) try out the ThermoWorks Billows fan, 2) cook the butts without wrapping, and 3) it was a rainy night / day, we had guests, and I didn't want fuss with the cook. I documented it in the Pork section (23 Hour Pork Butts Using Billows Fan) if you are interested. So, I know a KK23 can run at least 23 hours at 230°F with a single load of charcoal. I don't remember if I used coco or regular lump (when I use regular lump for low-and-slow, I use large pieces - baseball to softball size). I use a wax starter for low-and-slow, placed near the top of the charcoal pile with a just a few pieces of charcoal over the top, and with the dome shut, top and lower vents open. I shut them to the 225° position when the grate temperature is about 175° to let the KK heat sink at the desired temperature. Similar to @tekobo's description above. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffshoaf Posted February 16 Report Share Posted February 16 @MsTwiggy, I missed the post about you leaving the lid open. I only leave the lid open long enough to make sure my starter is burning. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
